Citation: Kaleida. "Into the Psyche: An Experience with 4-HO-EPT & Cannabis (exp109536)". Erowid.org. Feb 17, 2017. erowid.org/exp/109536
||(powder / crystals)
| T+ 0:45
This was my third experience with 4-HO-EPT. After my previous two trials of taking this chemical orally I had decided that I might want to try a harder-hitting route of administration next if I really wanted to get a full trip out of it, but today came and I had time to trip and I just felt that I would rather sacrifice a little extra of my supply to just get that fuller, longer-lasting, finally complete version of the 4-HO-EPT experience. In the end I would say that I was quite happy with this decision, as this 65 mg oral dose definitely did feel much more full than my past trips on it, and gave me pretty much everything I think I really needed out of this particular psychedelic experience.
My previous experience with psychedelics includes DMT, MET, MiPT, DiPT, DALT, Psilocybe cubensis, 4-HO-MET, 4-HO-DET, 4-HO-MPT, 4-HO-EPT, 4-HO-DPT, 4-HO-MiPT, 4-HO-DiPT, 4-HO-McPT, 4-AcO-DMT, 4-AcO-MET, 4-AcO-DET, 4-AcO-DALT, 5-HO-DMT, 5-MeO-MiPT, 5-MeO-DALT, Ipomoea tricolor, Argyreia nervosa, LSD, ETH-LAD, 2C-B, 2C-I, DOC, and MDMA. My most recent trip was fifteen days before this on 25 mg of 4-HO-McPT, which had only produced a very mild effect.
My headspace was a little different going into this trip than it is for the reports I usually write, so I feel that I should take a moment to explain some of that as well. While I have never been diagnosed with anything, I appear to have some sort of mood disorder, as I tend to feel things very strongly and for a very long time, and often following different sorts of triggers in my life. Stress appears to be one of the things that can make me more manic, and certain substances seem to push me a little further out there too, like cannabis often keeps me relatively hypomanic when I smoke it daily. Lately it has become clear to me though that alcohol might be one of my triggers for depression, even though the drunken phase itself generally has me more manic than normal.
I had this trip coming off of a couple weeks of vacation and partying including a night where I drank relatively heavily for the first time in quite a while, and again, though that night had been fine, since then I had definitely been feeling a dip in my moods, and the hypomania that I had sustained pretty well for the last few months became sorely missed. About a week or so after that night it got to the point where I could no longer ignore the fact that my thought trains seemed to be annoyingly stubborn in taking me down more negative trajectories than I'd dealt with in some time.
Stack this on top of the fact that life has just been sort of an emotional roller coaster for me for the past couple of weeks, with things happening both locally and globally that I'm both very happy and very sad about, and the fact that I just knew it was getting to me as I was having increasing urges to do things like drink or take random pills, and I realized that I had to do something about it. Knowing of course just how healing psychedelics can be in these matters, these thoughts then are what led me to try my highest dose yet with what is rapidly becoming one of my new favorite substances, and particularly after this experience.
So, here we go.
T+0:00 - I took 65 mg orally with water and a graham cracker. It had the usual bitter taste, but was also oddly sweet. Unfortunately I pushed it pretty much all around my mouth without trying to so the flavor was pretty strong, but the graham cracker did get rid of it pretty easily.
T+0:10 - Unlike my doubts with my last two 4-HO-EPT experiences, I was definitely already feeling something strong building up this quickly the way I would expect to with something like 4-HO-MET or 4-HO-MPT. I became excited for what was to come, and I decided to get in the shower to kill some time and help my body feel nice.
T+0:45 - During the shower I was actually coming up pretty hard, all things considered. One notable thing is that this did indeed carry on the trend of the lower doses of having almost no geometric visuals compared to other strong psychedelics, there were some shapes and colors pulsing around that were pretty interesting but they were fleeting and generally only in the corners of surfaces or textures, and with eyes closed nothing of that sort was really happening yet. But, despite that, my mind was starting to go wild. This was no longer the more lighthearted trip accessible with lower doses, my thoughts were in a full whirlwind of bouncing from one line to the next, moving rapid-fire through different topics like my emotions and forms of self-regulations, to media like television shows, to recent politics, but going so quickly as to only hop through each one without really developing into anything further, and creating lots of hectic and concrete but cartoony mental imagery to go along with it all.
When it came to be almost exactly forty-five minutes after dosing, this heavy mental phase calmed down dramatically and I felt almost sober again, other than the fact that I definitely had a very buzzy body high and dreamy head feeling still going on. This reminded me very much of my past 4-HO-EPT experiences and prompted me to try smoking cannabis at this point now, instead of waiting a full hour like before, as I felt that this might be where the come up phase really ends and therefore leads into the peak.
T+1:15 - From this point on, time stamps should be considered to be close approximations. After I started smoking the cannabis, I finally reached a point with this chemical where I was too swept up into the trip to remember or care about the passage of time. This initial part is definitely the hardest to remember or describe, because it really was far out there and still very, very much centered in the mind and emotions as opposed to being expressed in any hallucinogenic way. Even the faint visuals I got on my past trips now seemed less prevalent but instead manifested as my imagination becoming extremely vivid, colorful, and intense, but still not really 'seen' except in the mind's eye. Honestly, though I have no experience with this to say for sure, it reminded me the most of what I've read about 5-MeO-DMT, with the trip being so difficult to explain because it goes so deep into the self despite being so lacking in the hallucinogenic aspect, because it was basically just the most complex or ineffable effects of a strong psychedelic without much solid to really grab on to in retrospect.
What I can say in relation to something I have experienced is that the specific types of visions I was getting were of a kind that is extremely recognizable to me, because they were very much of a same kind I also get from high doses of LSD and 4-HO-MPT, much more so than anything else I've taken. For me, when I do get them they are invariably felt as the most hedonistic and stimulating visions I experience from any high, they constantly push my libido or cause my whole body to become overwhelmed with bliss or other such wonderful things for the entire time they're around. These kinds of things I also felt hints of on the lower doses of 4-HO-EPT so it's not too surprising, but I really was blown away with the intensity of them, and the fact that they brought along with them that entire combined headspace I'm used to, as opposed to 4-HO-MiPT for instance which brought me to only a very watered-down version of them. The 4-HO-EPT though, it was all the way there.... It was beautiful, penetrating, structured, and just overall remarkable. I found myself near spasming and breathing deeply just from how powerfully satisfying the whole thing was, my body could barely take it anymore.
About half way through this phase I also started listening to music, a few my old psychedelic favorites just to gauge my headspace and where the trip was at, and this was also a fantastic idea. The music enhancement I had noticed with lower doses was now reaching a full-blown euphoria of its own, I was laughing and rolling around and feeling like my body was just disappearing entirely into the bliss, and dancing through as much of it as I could even when I was lying down in bed. This was definitely one of my favorite parts of the trip, and it just made the aforementioned effects even deeper and more interesting. However, after I took off my headphones to relax for a minute I could hear my roommate making a bunch of noise in the living room, so I decided to go out and join him.
T+1:35 - I've enjoyed interacting with him, but it's still relatively difficult and I feel pretty heavy just wandering around the room. As I attempted to explain the experience to him it became more obvious to me just how out of it I really was, as I couldn't generally get out more than a few words to describe any given thought at one time. I basically told him that it was pretty fascinating because it felt deep like a powerful LSD trip, but I still couldn't get over the fact that it had basically no hallucinations of any kind other than in the mind's eye. I listened to a bit of what was going on his day too, but it became increasingly harder to follow with time, and eventually I decided to escape back into my room as he was doing chores.
T+2:25 - I went through a couple phases of listening to music and then wandering back out in the living room, but I never ended up staying and just retreated to my psychedelic cave. It was much more enjoyable to just get lost in the mental aspect of the experience and the sensory enhancement than try to do anything on it, though there was a decent amount of stimulation I was feeling as well, just not enough to overcome the heaviness or feeling of disconnection. It's notable as well that while I was in there I did notice a few more strong, fleeting visuals on surfaces, things that were highly detailed and complex to a level that many psychedelic visuals aren't, but they still only took up a very limited amount of space and could not be brought out consistently.
T+2:55 - I decided to try the solo sexual effects of this chemical, as I honestly had been avoiding it but I just couldn't help myself, the high felt so erotic and gave me so much craving. There was definitely a feeling to the whole thing that I've heard others describe with certain tryptamines where it feels like it increases both the desire for dopamine and the reward one gets from receiving it.... I can't speak to the accuracy of the neurochemical aspect of that, but I definitely get what they're trying to say: it makes me want that feel good feel, and want it bad. Accordingly, the physical stimulation was pretty satisfying right from the start, and the orgasm was mind-numbing in a way similar to how it has been on some of my best LSD experiences. Definitely a winner in that respect! Afterwards I definitely felt way too sweaty for how I like to be while tripping that hard though, so I decided to take another shower.
T+3:15 - I finished my shower, which was again quite nice, and re-emerged to hang out with my roommate some more. He was also smoking a bit at that point, so I took my first hit of cannabis since before, when I had finished like half a bowl that had been dumped out since then. Over the next hour I talked to him a bit more until he left to do some more chores, and then I ordered lunch and just relaxed and considered how incredible I still felt. I definitely felt as though I was past the heaviest part of the trip now, but I was no in no way coming down. I was still feeling a lot of body and mind euphoria on a level that most other psychedelics have not been able to bring me to as of yet.
T+4:10 - The food arrives, a tuna sandwich and chips, and I eat it with much excitement. It was extremely delicious, though it always is. Afterwards I decided to load the rest of the bowl from before back into the bong and finish smoking it while watching The Office, and just thinking back on what a fascinating trip it had been.
T+4:40 - At this point my roommate had returned but wasn't feeling good, so he way lying down in bedroom while I was just spaced out on the couch. I noticed that when I stared at the carpet I still started getting some visuals pretty quickly, and relatively strong though nothing too distinct. Mostly things like pieces of textures moving around, or the whole carpet sort of pulsing in waves or breaths. Still, it was enough to feel like I'm certainly still on a psychedelic.
T+5:45 - I had some other plans for the day as well, and at this point I felt good to drive, so I stopped really attempting to take notes. I still didn't feel 100% back to normal for honestly most of the day, but I wasn't too out of it to function anymore.
T+12:30 - I'm eating dinner, and the cannabis I've been smoking has definitely been keeping the high going it, but I'm still feeling it somewhat. The body is still heavy and buzzing, and when I relax my vision unfocuses more easily than normal. Nothing else though, and after sleeping I felt totally sober and content again.
It's now the next morning after the trip as I'm writing this, and I have to say that I already feel much better than I did leading up to this experience. I hope and think that the 4-HO-EPT did have something of an antidepressant effect for me as I was wishing it would, but we'll have to see how these next few days unfold. Nevertheless, the trip itself was still quite intriguing and refreshing regardless, it was the kind of trip I love but that I haven't had in over a year since I took 50 mg of 4-HO-MPT last October, and even longer before that since I was using LSD more. Essentially, though there is definitely a lot more to it than this and I expect it to take many experiences to reveal more of its true self to me, at this point it felt very much like the same kind of headspace I would always take high doses of LSD for felt like almost nothing else could ever quite compare to, but possibly even more rewarding and without practically any hallucinogenic effects at all, basically just the most mentally-focused psychedelic trip I think I could even imagine. And this has now caused 4-HO-EPT to jump further up my list of favorites than most other substances could really hope to.... Along with LSD and 4-HO-MPT, I think it may now be the only other psychedelic I so far consider to be truly top tier for me for causing this particular kind of experience.
In the end, I absolutely look forward to exploring more with this one. I am sure that there is quite a lot more to see of it and that I have only scratched the surface so far!
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