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A Valid and Enjoyable Part of a Drug-Arsenal
Citation:   Evil_Dave83. "A Valid and Enjoyable Part of a Drug-Arsenal: An Experience with Piperazines (exp57269)". Dec 5, 2006.

T+ 0:00
200 mg oral BZP (pill / tablet)
  T+ 0:00 100 mg oral Piperazines (pill / tablet)
  T+ 2:15 120 mg oral BZP (pill / tablet)
  T+ 2:15 180 mg oral Piperazines (pill / tablet)
A friend of mine had been enjoying a six month long MDMA honeymoon, getting into that stuff with alarming regularity. Given the cost and concerns about possible health effects he decided to research legal, MDMA-like highs on the internet and came up with piperazine blends as a potential alternative. The result was a fun first time for me and fun second time for my friend (who decided he couldn't wait to try them out and gave the tablets a whirl two days before we had our planned experiment). Although my piperazine experience was not directly analogous with an MDMA experience it was nonetheless highly enjoyable - separate but equal, if you will. At a cost of about 8 it was cheaper than MDMA, and is much better value than most similarly priced, non-piperazine legal highs that I have tried in the UK.

Please note I consistently refer to piperazines in the general, as I have no basis from which to try and separate out experiences resulting from specific chemicals of the family. This also means that I cannot assess the versatility of piperazine blends or different dosages (for me one of the delights of MDMA is its versatility - the variety of experiences it can provide, from low-dose loquacity to double-drop roller-coaster to large-bomb mega-high!).

So, to the actual experience. I went to a club with a group of 9 friends/friends of friends, all but two of whom took either piperazines or MDMA. The other two drank alcohol and smoked weed, and ended up leaving at about 4 am as a result of tiredness. Neither had any major problem communicating with those of us on piperazines (or MDMA for that matter), and they didn't feel frozen out by not being part of the drug experience, although this is perhaps as much down to us being good friends as it is the specific nature of piperazines. The club was particularly drug-friendly, with a variety of people from different backgrounds and age-groups on a variety of substances. Ecstasy was the main drug of choice, but we had no problems fitting in with the other pill-heads. Although we didn't have any problems keeping going until 6 am and beyond, none of the 3 of us on piperazines particularly felt like dancing, or able to keep dancing when we started. Again, this may be a social thing, as our MDMA use has tended to be more sociable than dance-oriented and none goes clubbing much.

We dropped the first pill (XXX - 200mg BZP 100mg mBZP) at about quarter past eleven, reached the club at half past and queued for entry until midnight. The pills kicked in within half an hour, and my coming up was marked by a quickened pulse and some changes to my sense of touch. The experience was rather disorienting, not unpleasant but not enjoyable, unlike the huge 'boost' feeling that I get with MDMA. During this period, despite these sensations I was able to hold a lucid conversation about my work (as a doctoral student part way through his research this is a confusing, complex and sometimes boring business). By the time I got inside I was definitely feeling the effects of the pill, which included a state of mental tranquillity, a body buzz and a heightened sense of touch. The quickened heart beat left me within half an hour of the drug starting to kick in (mushroom nausea also leaves me quite quickly after the initial 'here we go' lurch). The effects of the drug grew steadily in strength for the next hour - no waves - at which point (shortly after 1am) I took the second pill (Devils - 120mg BZP, 180mg Piperazine blend). At this point I also took a couple of 5-HTP gel-caps, which I proceeded to take a pair of about every 1 1/2 hours whilst in the club. As piperazines are thought to stimulate the receptivity of certain areas of the brain to serotonin, but not to over-stimulate serotonin production, the idea was that the 5-HTP would give a serotonin boost and thus augment the high. It certainly didn't have a negative effect as far as any of us could tell.

The second pill seemed to subtly strengthen the sensations I was getting from the early one, and I was now experiencing a strong physical sensation of being stoned, although my movement was not restricted. My body switched erratically from feeling hot to feeling cold, which was quite pleasant as the shivers and heat waves could feel quite delicious. However, I could still distinctly feel when I was getting too cold, such as when sat outside, or up against an air-conditioning vent. There was a mental tranquillity, which was very pronounced - I was calm but not befuddled, and whilst I was able to relax and not care about personal problems I didn't forget them or force them aside: they just didn't bother me. Not the most loquacious person (only mushrooms make me babble - I even shut up on MDMA), I would occasionally stop talking to people and enjoy the drug-powered light-show, but I never felt like conversations were tiring or boring, or felt the need to be rude or abrupt in getting out of one (except when my bladder called, which was on the hour, every hour, unfortunately - I was quite thirsty and drank about one pint of water per hour). Although I was high, I wasn't experiencing anything like the empathic response that MDMA can generate, but the physical and mental sensations were certainly not weak!

Although I smoked hashish throughout the night it was not until about 5am, having smoked over nearly ten hours, that I began to feel that the weed was dulling my thoughts. The THC was presumably having some effect, but it was hard to be specific about what - probably a contribution to the general sensation of being stoned. The piperazine high seemed to be marked by a clarity of thought less common to MDMA - I was capable of holding a conversation without getting lost or confused (unlike MDMA, where I can easily lose my train of thought which I don't get with MDMA - and also a greater sense of perspective than MDMA, which I find tends to wrap me up in the here-and-now of the high. There was some temporal dilation, but it was more a case of time not mattering rather than time seeming to change pace. At no point did I feel an urgent need for more drugs - it was nice if a spliff was going round, but I wasn't urgently in need of one, and two piperazine pills satisfied me. Again, this is different to MDMA where I experience a desire for more of anything available (MDMA has led me to try stronger drugs which I would *never* have wished to take if sober, drunk, or high on weed, mushrooms, acid or piperazines.) The main effects of the trip kicked in at about 2am - almost 3 hours after my first pill and about 3/4 of an hour after the second plus 5-HTP. I felt very high, not particularly empathic but not disassociative, and was treated to a wonderful flickering of LED-like lights across people and surfaces, without any apparent pattern. When I shut my eyes I experienced closed-eye visuals which were as complex as LSD visuals, but with clearly defined patterns. All the colours of the rainbow danced behind my eyes, and they seemed to key in to subconscious thoughts to create images and patterns which had a certain recognisable, rational characteristic. I am particularly prone to LED-type lights, whatever the drug (yup, even bonged bushweed can do it for me), but these were undoubtedly the most spectacular I have experienced (as cool as watching clouds dance and boil whilst on acid!) and were a definite highlight of the trip.

The effects had calmed down substantially by 5.30 am, but I was still noticeably under the influence at 6 am, when we left. In the cold morning light the greys of tarmac took on a subtle green tint, and my vision seemed a little washed out. Sunglasses would have been nice, as after so long dilated and smoke-drenched my eyes were tired. I tried to go to sleep at about 10 am but was unable to, despite feeling tired. I undoubtedly made a tactical error in taking more 5-HTP whilst trying to get to sleep, thinking the serotonin would make me sleepy. Not at all - it seemed to react with whatever piperazines were left to keep the closed-eye visuals and mentally-tired-but-awake feelings going. I eventually got to sleep at 2 am the next morning! However, during the day I was able to deal with some important personal business, for which I was, although obviously coming down off something, able to conduct myself (almost) soberly, without the morning-after euphoria I experience with MDMA (which precedes the dreaded Tuesday Blues, which I did not experience with piperazines). Before going to bed I also went to a gig where I drank three or four beers (UK, which means pints at 4.5% abv) and headbanged like a mad bastard. No headaches or hard jaw-clenching to report at any point, and although I only ate half a packet of sweets (Haribo Star Mix, to be precise) and about 20g of chocolate I didn't feel like I was running out of energy. Indeed, the thought of eating anything substantial was unappetising.

I was rather wiped out on Sunday, but still capable of watching a football match (US) until 1am Monday morning and of getting up at 10 am that morning to do some work (I'm a student). Other than a need to catch up on some sleep I experienced no ill effects in the days after. Furthermore, once I came down from the piperazines I felt as though I had had enough drugs for the next month. I didn't feel burned-out, as with acid or heavy MDMA use, just relaxed that I had enjoyed a fine experience and that would last me until the club night came around again next month. Although I eventually caved and tried another legal high whilst at a gig (I had been hoping for Purple Ohms - UK legal mushrooms-lite - but was disappointed by Lime Fantazia - UK legal, wishes it was piperazines, claims to be ecstasy-like), and did smoke some weed and drink quite heavily I felt very relaxed about not immediately getting back into the hard stuff.

So, to summarise...

- Capable of producing strong drug sensations and experiences. Not MDMA but not weaker in any meaningful sense, nor any less enjoyable
- Superb! closed-eye visuals and open-eye LED flickerings
- Clarity of thought (until the weed finally got through)
- No substantial hangover
- If you stay awake you still have some stamina for walking, headbanging etc

- No MDMA type rushes
- No heightened empathic/emotional sensations
- Can be hard to sleep afterwards (especially if you monkey about eating 5-HTP!)

As you can see, most of my negatives are really matters of preference in your high, rather than problems with my experience on piperazines. I know this sounds like an on-line store write-up, but they really were that good. Obviously, if you take them wanting MDMA you'll be a bit disappointed, but if you can get away from MDMA based desires and preconceptions you'll find an interesting drug, if, perhaps, not as interesting as MDMA. The soul of piperazines felt different - the high was cleaner and more consistent, rather than prone to waves and changes in the sensations of the strength of the drug. The music and people weren't so deeply lovely as they can feel on MDMA - the sensation was rather more introspective, but not isolationist or disassociative. In an odd way, they are perhaps less fun in the sense that having six pints and then popping a pill or dropping a bomb is a kind of free-wheeling, spontaneous possibility with MDMA. But if you're prepared to take a little more time in planning and want a cheap, fun, fucked night out piperazines can be a valid and enjoyable part of a drug-arsenal.

Dave out.

Exp Year: 2006ExpID: 57269
Gender: Male 
Age at time of experience: Not Given
Published: Dec 5, 2006Views: 44,656
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Piperazines (99) : Club / Bar (25), First Times (2)

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