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The Return to Oz
4-Ho-DiPT & 2C-E
by RedRabbit
Citation:   RedRabbit. "The Return to Oz: An Experience with 4-Ho-DiPT & 2C-E (exp32530)". Jun 16, 2004.

T+ 0:00
20 mg oral 4-HO-DiPT (capsule)
  T+ 2:00 25 mg oral 4-HO-DiPT (capsule)
  T+ 0:59 25 mg oral 2C-E (capsule)


t-00:00 20mg 4-Ho-DiPT
t-02:00 25mg 4-Ho-DiPT + 25mg 2C-E

Well, the night before last, I experiemented with 2C-E alone, 20mg. (See under 2C-E experiences). It was overall a good experience, nothing really negative at all about it, excpet that I wish I had taken a little more. I didn't really find what I was looking for. What am I looking for? I don't know, I'll tell you when I find it.

So anyway, I also had some 4-Ho-DiPT that I wanted to try. Since this was a tryptamine as opposed to a phenethylamine like 2C-E, I hoped it would provide me with something the 2C-E seemed to lack. What 2C-E seemed to lack for me was that loss of self, I was completely in control of my thoughts it seemed on 2C-E, (I think I have heard it called straight tripping, your tripping sensory wise, but your thoughts are otherwise close to normal.) I should also point out that I have been measuring my doses by halving piles of known quantities, which is not entirely accurate to say the least. But I would guess my estimates are within a few milligrams. So it is also possible that I just didn't take enough 2C-E to do the job. But there was still defintitely a more clear headed quality to the 2C-E than I have ever experienced before on a psychedelic drug (a low dose of mescaline comes close).

This report is about last night however, in which I intended to give 4-Ho-DiPT its turn by it self. However, after taking roughly 25mg of it and waiting 2 hours, I felt almost nothing. I could feel the effects ever so slightly, but they wern't getting any stronger. I was really dissapointed, I was prepared for a powerful trip, hopefully more powerful than the night before, but nope nothing. In my frustration, I said fuck it, and dropped another 25mg of the 4-Ho-DiPT, since the first 25 seemed to do nothing, and just to be sure I would get off, I also took 20mg of the 2C-E. 'There' I said to my self, if I don't get off now it will be an act of God. I just finished watching 'Waking Life', and decided to watch 'The Matrix' as I waited for Kansas to go Bye-Bye.

t+01:00 - (3 hours after my initial dose of 4-Ho-DiPT, 1 hour after my redosing). OK, the Matrix has to go. I am already tripping too hard to watch something so dark and violent. Everything has a greenish hue to it. Of course my room is mostly green, and so does the Matrix have a geen hue to it, but this was way over the top, like I had green tinted goggles on. I can definitely feel the effects of both drugs. (My second dosing was pretty much on an empty stomach, so it hit me quickly). By the way all my doeses were taken in gelcaps. I could feel the 'Body-buzz' which I associated with the 2C-E, and the visuals; vibrating textures, fractal patterns on my wall, facial distorions of the characters on TV, and breathing surfaces, which I associated with both drugs. There were more to the visuals than the previous night. I also had some slight digestive discomfort, but nothing serious.

I was still coming up on the drugs, and I knew I was in for a serious ride, so I buckled my seatbelt and threw in 'The Wizard of Oz' once more, (I had watched it the night before as well). I needed something light, and since it was already in my DVD player, I went with it.

After thought on facial distortions: It's well know that we have whole seperate part of the visual processing devoted to face recognition. That is when we perceive a face we use a very different part of brain than when we perceive other objects. This dedicated set of neurons is most likely much more sensative to nuances of small details than the rest if our visual processing. Whether the drugs effect this part of the brain differently - (which I doubt, it seems more likely that there are just more of these neurons to be affected, in other words its a matter of quantity, not qaulity), or perhaps this part of the brain is just thrown off more by the overall visual distortions).

t+01:30 - Well, Dorothy, Toto, and I are in Oz once again. This time however I am tripping too hard to really focus on the movie. My body is very heavy and trying to make sense of the visul images on my TV just takes too much effort. So I lay back on my bed, close my eyes, and let the drugs take me where they will. I can feel my self, my body, and mind slipping away, floating off to some other world. 'How can you talk if you haven't got a brain?' I hear Dorothy say. 'I don't know?' replies the Scarecrow. In a way I feel like I haven't got brain either, just a flow of images, feelings, loose assocations, I am flowing though another world. Of course I still do have a brain, but at the moment the rhyme or reason to what a brain is and whether I have one is inconsequential to me. I, whatever 'I' am is certainly not what or where 'I' was an hour ago. I can feel what I believe to be the 4-Ho-DiPT pulling deeper into this other world. I am totaly at peace with this, and looking forward to where it may take me, unfortunately I also feel what I believe is the 2C-E pulling me back.

It's almost like the 4-Ho-DiPT is leading me towards an internal experience, and the 2C-E towards an external one. I know this is all very subjective, but thats how I interpreted it. As the effects of the 2C-E continued to grow it seems it won out, and I never did finish that journey inward.

t+02:30 - As the Wizard of Oz comes to end, and I have come back to this world at least for the most part, though I am still heavily under the influence of at least one of these drugs, and probably both still, the moral of The Wizard of Oz becomes so clear to me. We already have all we need to be happy inside of ourself, yet somehow it seems we must look everywhere else for it; until at least we realize that what we need is just not out there, it is in here. Sadly, while I have this intellectual realization, I do not feel the truth of this. I can not seem to find what I am looking for inside or outside of my self.

t+03:00 - I have been watching 'The Sound of Music' again, which I also watched the night before. I figure if 'The Wizard of Oz' had something more to offer me than it did last night, then maybe so does this movie. Plus again, I wanted something positive uplifting. Just listening to the birds and watching the waving grass of the opening menu screen of the DVD is so blissful. There is a scene where Maria is on her way to her assignment, to be the new governess for the 7 children of the retired Navy Captain. She sings her song about being confident in her self, but in reality she is scared and nervious. Does she really convince her self that she has confidence? Confidence seems to be one of those 'which came first the chicken or the egg?' questions. Does confidence breed success or does success breed confidence? I definitely lack confidence in many aspects of my self. How do I summon the confidence from nothing to be successful?

I think about this presentation I have to give for my Machine Learning class on Monday. I am really uncomfortable about it. It's one of the most horrible experiences for me to be up in front of a large group of people, vunerable, exposed, on display, with the fear of ridicule and judgement looming like a 2 ton weight upon my mind. To be successful, I must summon the confidence from somewhere, though I feel I have none.

t+03:30 - Eventually I lose interst in watching the movie, at least for the time being. It seems there is too much I need to think about. I need peace and quiet. So I curl up in comfy chair and I just stare off into nothing. My mind seems to lack the ability to focus on any one thought in particular, and I don't try to force it to. I just let my thoughts wonder where they may. At one point I have these flash images of a small boy crying, they seem to have just come from nowhere. He is alone and so sad. It is obvious that I am seeing some part of me. He needs to be comforted and loved I think, but how can I reach him. He is after all me, but he is something from the past, yet he is still there inside me waiting to be loved. Can we save our selves from our selves? How can I ever be loved if I don't love my self? How can I love my self if I am not loved by others? As the Wizard of Oz put it, is the size of a man's heart really judged by how much he is loved by others and not by how much he loves?

The rest of my experience was fairly uneventful, I think after the shorter acting 4-Ho-DiPT wore off the intensity of the trip dropped down several notches. The intial 25mgs of DiPT must surely have been almost entirely metabolized by then. I finished watching 'The Sound of Music' and waited for sleep to come, which would be about 10 hours after my intial 25mgs of DiPT. I awoke today about 8 hours later, feeling not bad, but a little fatigued mentally and physical. I don't think the 2 drugs went bad together by maybe the odd timing of my doses made the trip a little less smooth and continuous then it could have been. If I had it to do over again, which I just might but not for some time, I might have liked to take a smaller does of the 2C-E, maybe 10-15 mg, and 40-50mgs of the 4-Ho-DiPT in one shot maybe an hour after dosing with the 2C-E. I have to wonder if I needed such a high dose of DiPT because of some kind of cross tolerance from the 2C-E I took the night before. It seems plausible, as I can't imagine why the 25mgs of my initial dosing of the DiPT had almost no effect on me what so ever.

See you on the other side.

Exp Year: 2004ExpID: 32530
Gender: Male 
Age at time of experience: Not Given 
Published: Jun 16, 2004Views: 13,990
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4-HO-DiPT (281), 2C-E (137) : Combinations (3), Alone (16)

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