Donate to Erowid with Cryptocurrency
We take Bitcoins and other cryptocurrencies to support practical information about
psychoactive drugs. A great way to donate without lots of fees. Contribute a bit today!
Smart Drugs and Antidepressants: Summary
Deprenyl, Piracetam, Hydergine, Tianeptine, Picamilon, Vasopressin, Choline, Lucidril, Fluoxetine, Adrafinil & Vinpocetine
by Fred
Citation:   Fred. "Smart Drugs and Antidepressants: Summary: An Experience with Deprenyl, Piracetam, Hydergine, Tianeptine, Picamilon, Vasopressin, Choline, Lucidril, Fluoxetine, Adrafinil & Vinpocetine (ID 14231)". Erowid.org. Jun 30, 2003. erowid.org/exp/14231

 
DOSE:   oral Various (pill / tablet)
      Pharms - Selegeline  
      Piracetam  
      Hydergine  
      Picamilon  
      Vasopressin  
      Adrafinil  
      Vinpocetine  
      Pharms - Fluoxetine  
      Vitamins - Choline  
      Pharms - Tianeptine  

BODY WEIGHT: 185 lb


I have been experimenting with various smart drugs and anti-depressants for a little less than a year. I have no history of prolonged depression, and other than ingesting a low dose of green medicine from a certain spiny source every 3-4 weeks, I choose not to use any other substance regularly. I don't smoke and the only alcohol I choose to consume is perhaps a sip of homemade absinthe every month or so. I do consume a small mocha about 2-3 times per week, but I do not drink soft drinks or take in any other forms of caffeine. I am in my late twenties, and although I am a few (5-10) pounds heavier than I would like, I exercise regularly. High blood pressure runs in my family, and I was borderline hypertensive until I started partaking in the green medicine, around a year ago. (My blood pressure dropped from a fairly constant average of 130/90 to a fairly constant average of 125/75, thanks to some unknown cacti phenomenon (?!).

In the last two months, with the help of Hawthorn extract every three days, my blood pressure has finally reached a very healthy 110/68 average, but that is another story for another day...). Anyway... that is my brief (and yet thorough) medical background.

My interest in trying smart drugs and antidepressants is to gain insight into personality and how the mind works, and to discover potential tools for future use in therapy with clients, friends going through hard times, and general personal growth. If added benefits are increased intelligence and mood lift, then so be it! :) To date (knock on wood), I have not experienced any long-term negative effects, as judged by myself or by my intimate friends and my girlfriend.

Piracetam, 800-1600mg daily, with 250mg Choline supplement.
Duration of Experiment: Ongoing - 3 weeks on, 1 week off.
Cardiovascular effects: none observed.
This combination markedly stabilizes my mood. On this regimen (the only one which feels gentle and worth pursuing long term), I notice a slight increase in clarity of thought – nothing extraordinary. It’s been found that Piracetam increases the effects of stimulants and alcohol. I would also like to point out (from experience) that Piracetam dramatically increases the effects of phenethylamines as well - the body load is slightly higher (seen as an increase in blood pressure and heart rate), and while Piracetam introduces some clarity of thought, it also increases the raw intensity of the mental and emotional aspects of a phenethylamine trip. I have not yet tried Piracetam in combination with any tryptamine compounds, so I cannot report on this combination yet. (I am generalizing my experience from the cacti to all phenethylamines because of the general chemical resemblance to amphetamine).

Piracetam, 800-1600mg daily, with Hydergine.
Duration of Experiment: 1 week.
This combination consistently gives me a moderate tension headache. (I gave up on this combination after a week). Piracetam with Hydergine quite markedly changes my character so that I tend to enjoy the intellectual world to a greater extent. However, I am usually more of a “heart person” than a “head person”, and this combination definitely pushes me towards the centerline to the extent that my outward personality shifts in a noticeable (and in my opinion, negative) fashion.

Lucidril.
Duration of Experiment: 1 week.
Lucidril is a substance that is supposed to increase concentration. Lucidril makes me slightly restless and puts me in generally negative, focused, intense mood. On Lucidril I experience mild insomnia, which is only one of many reasons I gave up on this combination after a week.

Deprenyl, 5mg
Duration of Experiment: 5 days.
Cardiovascular effects: slightly increased pulse.
This is an incredible substance used as a smart drug, in addition to being used to manage Parkinson’s disease. It is a controlled substance in Japan. Taking a full pill (5mg) puts me in a rather over-focused state with quite a tension headache. I can’t fathom having to take multiple pills a day to treat any illness; I would be transformed into an overly motivated, talkative, ultra focused basket case of a human being. Anyway, at 5mg, a mood lift (in a power-trippy sort of way) is always present. My attitude changes significantly - I become more talkative, and anything intellectual draws my attention. My feelings are largely ignored when experimenting with Deprenyl alone, which I feel is a negative. The dramatic increase in dopamine often gives me chills of pleasure if I happen to drink a small mocha or ingest a tiny amount of caffeine and listen to some music. (Deprenyl is a MAOI inhibitor, but it only inhibits MAO-B, which is responsible for breaking down dopamine. Deprenyl has been shown to reduce damage to the seratonin system after MDMA ingestion in rats. I don’t recommend trying this at home, though). Deprenyl at this dose caused a marked change in my personality that my girlfriend immediately noticed after only 1 day of use.

Deprenyl, 2.5mg
Duration of Experiment: 1 week.
Cardiovascular effects: minimal, if any.
This is my perfect dose. At this dose, Deprenyl acts as an incredible antidepressant, increases my sexual desire, and gives me very nice chills (if combined with up-beat music and a small mocha). On a 2.5mg dose, “people-watching” becomes a more-thrilling-than-usual activity. Plus, I am not pushed so far into the intellectual world that my emotions are ignored. No significant change in attitude/personality is present at this dose.

Deprenyl, 2.5mg and Piracetam + Choline
Duration of Experiment: 1 week, and ongoing (occasional)
This is a powerful combination that feels very stable, with no adverse side effects noted. I feel that this could be a powerful cure for depression, along with increasing focus and intellectual performance. I found the mood lift to be quite unnecessary in my life, though, and Deprenyl feels like it could be slightly psychologically addictive, so this is a no-go for me, long-term. There is definitely a small bit of recreational potential here, along with a great use for treating day-after post phenethylamine “brain-and-mood-sluggishness”. (Piracetam has been shown to actually repair damage to the brain done by alcohol, and I have a feeling it might decrease the “re-boot” time of the areas of the brain that are ignored while on mescaline. In my experience, this combination has proved extremely useful in returning me to full cognitive ability and stabilized mood even the day after a moderately intense trip).

Adrafinil, 300-900mg
Duration of Experiment: 1 week, and several other isolated occasions.
Cardiovascular effects: slight increase in blood pressure (minimal) and pulse (noticeable).
Adrafinil is a stimulant in the subtlest way. It’s not very physically stimulating or “mind-racing”, but when necessary, it allows me to be social and engaged without getting tired. I had the opportunity to take this drug around the holiday season when I had to be chatty with everyone – family, friends, and strangers. Despite a persistent, mild headache, I was able to stay engaged and in non-negative/grouchy spirits for significantly longer than usual. However, outside of a chatty environment (one on one), my girlfriend noticed a change in personality, almost a depersonalization and “drifting intensely” from one deep thought to another. This effect goes away when there is something to concentrate on, but the constant need for input is frustrating. I don’t see Adrafinil as a useful tool other than for family get-togethers. There is no mood lift involved with the Adrafinil experience for me, even when I got very “experimental” and tried snorting it once. (Ewwww...)

Adrafinil, 300-900mg and Piracetam + Choline
Duration of Experiment: 1 week. (or less?)
Adrafinil pretty much overpowered the Piracetam and Choline. The Adrafinil headache became more intense, and I actually felt grouchy on this combination.

Vasopressin
Duration of Experiment: 6-7 times, spread out over a month.
This nasal spray and anti-diuretic is quite potent. It’s used with children to treat bed-wetting, since it totally eliminates the urge to pee for a very long period of time (5-6 hours or more!). I have found that it gives me a slight headache, and although it increases the formation of memories, I am much less intelligent “in-the-moment” while on Vasopressin. Things feel slightly “cloudy” and “off.” This could, however, be a useful study tool in cutting down rote memorization time. I have a feeling this could be a miracle smart-drug for somebody, but for me it feels too “harsh”. I also had a very negative experience with this substance and alcohol (that report is also written up).

Prozac and Deprenyl (2.5mg)
Duration of Experiment: 5 days.
This combination has recreational potential, but since Prozac significantly altered my personality in interacting with others, I stopped experimenting with this combo shortly after I began. The Deprenyl “chills”, combined with the Prozac “calm – everything is fine... just fine” offers quite a fun state of peacefully watching the world go by, and yet feeling very involved and invigorated. However, my personal intuition and ability to connect on a one-on-one level diminishes significantly, because it no longer holds any additional interest to me; I am just content watching the world go by on my own. This, in my opinion, is a fairly sad shift, and therefore this is not a combination for me.

Prozac and Piracetam + Choline
Duration of Experiment: 5 days.
Prozac completely overwhelmed any effects of the Piracetam and Choline. This felt very similar to the above report, except without the “chills of excitement.” I just felt “blah and good.” Perhaps I just don’t like the effect Prozac has on my personality?

Vinpocetine, 5mg
Duration of Experiment: 3 weeks.
Vinpocetine is a vasodilator with the added benefit of reducing plaque levels in the brain commonly associated with old-age memory loss and even Alzheimer’s disease. It also is reported to increase intelligence. Vinpocetine feels like “gingko biloba on steroids”. A very slight headache is consistently present, and I notice no significant mood change. I cannot detect any cognitive benefits from taking Vinpocetine alone.

Vinpocetine with Piracetam + Choline
Duration of Experiment: 3 weeks.
This combination slightly increases the effects of Piracetam and Choline. However, it introduces a slight tension headache, and in my opinion, is not worth the slight cognitive benefit over Piracetam and Choline alone.

Vinpocetine with Adrafinil
Duration of Experiment: 3 days.
Moderate headache, no real benefits felt. Grouchy, restless mood.

Picamilon
Duration of Experiment: 1 week.
This interesting combination of GABA and Niacin is fairly new and is being sold as an antidepressant. Take one pill and it’s supposed to cause a decrease in anxiety and a stabilization of mood. Take two pills and it’s supposed to give you energy and allow you to work harder and longer than usual. I was skeptical at first, but in fact, the effects closely followed the dosage claim for me. On a dose of one pill, my mood stabilizes to a rather frustrating level. I don’t notice a mood lift, but I do notice that my contented-ness with how everything is (that is usually present in my life, substance or not) is slightly increased. Perhaps this would be useful for someone with anxiety, but for me it really serves no positive purpose. A dose of two pills also offers me no mood lift, but that “contented-ness” with how everything is increases so that I am just fine doing whatever work needs to be done. I wouldn’t call it motivation, but once I begin an activity, I feel very content following it to completion and with vigor and (abnormally) increased dedication.

Picamilon and Piracetam + Choline
Duration of Experiment: 1 week.
This is the most mood-stabilizing combination I encountered in my experimentation. I experience a slight mood lift from the Piracetam and Choline, and the Picamilone removes any deviation from that “mood lift-ed” state. This combination also seems very conducive to studying or working on in-depth problem solving. I feel contentment exploring statistical and mathematical problems that normally would cause me some anxiety and possible frustration. I feel like I am in no hurry to find the solution (although I am happy to steadily plod deeper into the problem), and my mood never has shifted to one of frustration, even given frustrating circumstances.

Picamilon and Deprenyl (2.5mg) and Piracetam + Choline
Duration of Experiment: 3 (very fun) days.
Wheeee. The Picamilon removes many of the “awe-inspired” shivers from the Deprenyl + Piracetam + Choline experience. Oh well. However, I repeatedly experience a deep contentment with life and how things are on this combination. Unlike Prozac, my personality remains stable and unchanged. I enjoy exploring the intellectual world, but I also enjoy dwelling in the emotional and “here-and-now, you-and-me” world as well. I experience a dramatic increase in the ease with which I can communicate with others, because I can't possibly feel threatened or anxious about any response they might give. However, it isn’t a forced openness or a push to communicate; I simply can choose to communicate on a very heartfelt, direct level with others, without any anxiety. This combination isn’t “dulling” either (ie: Valium), which is more of a “sit back, relax, it doesn’t matter that much, just enjoy the world” feeling.

This combination definitely felt like it has abuse potential, and I will save this enjoyable, useful combination for difficult times in my life where I need to communicate and feel on a deep, heartfelt level about very difficult things. This combination reminded me of MDMA, but (1) without such a dramatic push towards complete euphoria (just contentedness), (2) without a push to connect with and “love” everybody, and (3) no comedown or brain-fry.

Stablon
Duration of Experiment: 2 days.
Stablon increases the pre-synaptic reuptake of seratonin. I’d like to find out if this means that there is more seratonin in the synapses or less. It’s dreadfully expensive, but its effects are quite nice. With Stablon, I feel a contentedness like with Picamilone, and I also feel a push towards “awe” and noticing beauty in the world, especially if I ingest any amount of caffeine. With good music and a small amount of caffeine, this drug reminds me of really subtly tripping, but without the mental and emotional alteration or sensory overload. The feeling is slightly like, “I am immersed in the world to a much greater extent, but I am not fearful of it because I am a part of all that I am immersed in.” It resembles a very tiny, tiny form of subtle ego death, if there is such a thing as SUBTLE ego death :)

Stablon, Piracetam + Choline
Duration of Experiment: 3 days
No added benefits were noted over Stablon alone. However, I did not ingest caffeine during the three days that I was experimenting with this combination, so I don’t feel like I gave it a completely fair shot.

Stablon, Deprenyl (2.5mg), Piracetam + Choline
Duration of Experiment: 2 days, spaced apart by 2 days
This combination easily rivals some of the lower dose, less legal substances out there, but with an increased mental clarity and an incredible feeling of well being throughout the experience (which lasts approximately 5 hours). This combination feels like it has the potential to be very psychologically addicting because there is such a dramatic mood lift, and yet (perhaps because it was week 2 on Stablon), one pill a day wasn’t giving me the same intensity of effects as it had initially. Having to take a larger dose of Stablon to experience the same benefits as before feels like a big warning sign that something is not cool with regular Stablon ingestion.

With this combination, I experience a state of wonder and awe, with great body shivers (when music is added), probably thanks to the Deprenyl. One day I noticed a very slight tension headache about 4 hours after ingestion. Communication is wonderful and fun and intimate, although I tended to introduce a giddiness and light-heartedness into the conversation at unusual times, especially during the first few hours. I feel extremely at peace with how things are on this combination, no matter how awkward or potentially hurtful something might be. Outward appearance and personality remained normal, except I probably looked insanely happy, relaxed, and smiled a lot.

Stablon, Deprenyl (2.5mg), Piracetam + Choline, Picamilone
Duration of Experiment: 1 day
Cardiovascular effects: slight decrease in blood pressure (?)
The addition of Picamilone added stability and grounding to the already-amazing experience I mentioned above. I only tried this combination once, perhaps because I felt so empowered and calm and happy and “in control” and “awestruck” and “at peace” that I felt this combination couldn’t possibly be good for me, and if I got used to this feeling, it could become an expensive and unsustainable habit. I definitely have noted this combination for the future if I ever feel like I am in a rut and need to look at things from a different, happier perspective. I feel like this combination can be used in a therapeutic environment as a subtler, more legally sound alternative to MDMA therapy. I’m looking forward to the next personal challenge in my life so that I can see if this combination makes it easier for me to work through and untie hurt emotions from a place of power and clarity (positive), or if it just puts me in a good mood and lets me forget about the problem (negative).

Well, those are my experience with some smart drugs and anti-depressants, and some combinations of both. Just because these substances are legal doesn’t mean that the substances (or combinations) aren’t dangerous. However, I feel like I now have more legal “tools” in my medicine bag. (It’s funny how you cannot legally ingest even low doses of mescaline for healing even once a year, yet it’s legal to take antidepressants and anti-anxiety medicine every day -- or even amphetamine for ADD. Personally, I’d rather see a client do personal ‘housecleaning’ once a month with a mild mescaline trip than constantly keep their issues at arms length with constant antidepressant use). Until next time (what WILL be next?!)...

[Reported Dose: 'Suggested or lower for each respective drug']

Exp Year: 2002ExpID: 14231
Gender: Male 
Age at time of experience: Not Given 
Published: Jun 30, 2003Views: 69,279
[ View as PDF (for printing) ] [ View as LaTeX (for geeks) ] [ Switch Colors ]

Experience Reports are the writings and opinions of the individual authors who submit them.
Some of the activities described are dangerous and/or illegal and none are recommended by Erowid Center.


Experience Vaults Index Full List of Substances Search Submit Report User Settings About Main Psychoactive Vaults